Rahul Gandhi: In India, you have to think about the problem of caste, because the dominant castes here use the money in their own way.

Dr. Banerjee: Maybe, but on the other hand, you can also stop it. In such a situation, I will keep some extra money so that it reaches the eligible people of the village. Exactly as you are saying in the case of PDS. That is, make it a principle. This way it can be avoided.

But you are talking about more than reaching money. Some people have Jan Dhan accounts and some do not. Some people are named in MNREGA, this is another way to reach people. Some have Ujjwala, some do not. Once you look at the list and you will know that millions of people are deprived of them, then how to benefit them? Yes, one thing is clear that the local administration should have money that can identify and benefit people. I agree with you that dominant castes can take advantage of this. We had similar fears in Indonesia, but it was not very big. I think we should try, knowing that some of it will be wrong. If you do not try, then there will be a big problem.

Rahul Gandhi: That is, move ahead courageously, take the risk because we are in a very bad position.

Dr. Banerjee: When you are in trouble, you should work with courage.

Rahul Gandhi: What do you think, if this disease is finished in 6 months from now, what will happen on the poverty front? It will have bad effects, people will go bankrupt. How do we deal with this medium term?

Dr. Banerjee: See what we are talking about. There is the issue of lack of demand. There are two concerns, first, how to avoid the chain of bankruptcy, debt forgiveness can be one way, as you said. The second is the reduction of demand, and the wheel of the Indian economy can be rotated by paying money in the hands of the people. America is doing so on a large scale. There is a Republican government run by some financiers. If we want, we can do it too. There is no government of liberal-minded socialists, but there are people who have been working in the financial sector. But they decided that to save the economy, people would have to pay money. I think we should learn from this.

Rahul Gandhi: This creates the possibility of some degree of change in the balance of power in the world, it is also clear. What do you think about it?

Dr. Banerjee: I care more about countries like Italy and France. Especially Italy, which suffered disastrous consequences and is partly a result of the fact that Italy did not have a qualified regime for many years. As a result, healthcare was absolutely paralyzed. America has adopted a nationalist view that is not right for the world. The rise of China is a threat to him and if America starts reacting to it then it will pose a risk of instability. This is the most worrying thing.

Rahul Gandhi: That is, strong leaders can deal with this virus. And it is being explained that only one man can beat this virus.

Dr. Banerjee: It would be fatal. The United States and Brazil are two countries that are badly in disarray. There are two purportedly strong leaders here, and they show that they know everything, but only laugh at what they say every day. If anyone has faith in the principle of a strong leader, they should think about it.

Rahul Gandhi: Thank you very much. Whenever you are in India, please drink tea together. Hello everyone at home.

Dr. Banerjee: You too, and take care of yourself.

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