Rahul Gandhi: I think you have to find alternatives. As much as possible decentralization, I think they can be dealt with locally, which is a good thing. The thinking should be that things which can be managed at the district level or at the state level should be separated. Yes, there are many things that no district collector can decide, such as airlines or railways etc. So I believe that major decisions should be at the national level, but decisions on local issues, such as lockdown, should be left to the discretion of the state government. The choice of the states should matter and the states should decide what they can and cannot do. And when the risk falls on the states, they will be able to handle it better. But I think the current government has a different view. They want to keep things under their control. They look at things and centralize it. These are two views. I don't think any of it is wrong or right. I am in favor of decentralization.

Dr. Banerjee: What do I think I would do? On the basis of whatever money I have, I would announce some good schemes that this money would reach the poor and then, seeing the effect of it, I would improve it further. I think there are many good NGOs in every state who can help in this. As you said, the District Magistrate also has good ideas at times. We should take advantage of all this.

Rahul Gandhi: Have you seen some experiences in other countries that can benefit?

Dr. Banerjee: Let me tell you what Indonesia is doing right now? Indonesia is going to give money to the people and all this is happening as a decision-making process at the community level. That is, the community is deciding who is needy? And then money is being transferred to him. We have worked with the Government of Indonesia and saw that this is a far more accurate process than a centralized process. With this you decide without thinking of any special interest. Here at the local level only people are deciding what is right? I think this is an experience from which we can learn. He told the community that look is money, and it has to be passed on to those who are in need. This is a good policy in an emergency because the community has that information and information many times, then you do not have it in a centralized system.

Rahul Gandhi: In India, you have to think about the problem of caste, because the dominant castes here use the money in their own way.

Dr. Banerjee: Maybe, but on the other hand, you can also stop it. In such a situation, I will keep some extra money so that it reaches the eligible people of the village. Exactly as you are saying in the case of PDS. That is, make it a principle. This way it can be avoided.

But you are talking about more than reaching money. Some people have Jan Dhan accounts and some do not. Some people are named in MNREGA, this is another way to reach people. Some have Ujjwala, some do not. Once you look at the list and you will know that millions of people are deprived of them, then how to benefit them? Yes, one thing is clear that the local administration should have money that can identify and benefit people. I agree with you that dominant castes can take advantage of this. We had similar fears in Indonesia, but it was not very big. I think we should try, knowing that some of it will be wrong. If you do not try, then there will be a big problem.

Rahul Gandhi: That is, move ahead courageously, take the risk because we are in a very bad position.

Dr. Banerjee: When you are in trouble, you should work with courage.

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